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#463481
LordJiro
Alright. I've seen the Flying Spaghetti Monster with my own eyes. There, that 'evidence' is EXACTLY as reliable as John's.
4/12/2008 7:16:26 PM
#463487
Osiris
Eyewitness evidence is not reliable especially if its in a book.
4/12/2008 7:20:11 PM
#463509
ID82
weren't the stories of jesus apparently written a century after his death or something?
4/12/2008 7:40:04 PM
#463511
onoma
@lordjiro, I too have seen the FSM. He touched me with his noodley appendage.
(First I was like "OWE!" and then I was like "oooooooooooh!")
4/12/2008 7:42:20 PM
#463515
John
Who says the authors of the Gospels were disciples of Jesus while he was alive? None of the twelve were named Mark or Luke. And most scholars don't think John or Matthew were the named disciples, either.
4/12/2008 7:45:49 PM
#463521
Allegory for Jesus
They were eyewitnesses because they say they were eyewitnesses? Cool...I was a witness of the JFK assassination, and I can personally attest that there was a second shooter on the grassy knoll, and it was the Hamburglar. Does that mean that my account must be correct? Or does that only work with Jesus?
4/12/2008 7:53:17 PM
#463526
Horsefeathers
"You have to big the biggest moron atheist on here. John 1, he point blank says "that our hands have held, that our eyes have seen".
They disciples were hand picked by Christ, and they make explicit claims to have been eyewitness
of him. "
See, there's this thing called "narrative fiction" that lets you have people do and say things that didn't actually happen.
4/12/2008 7:58:43 PM
#463545
Antichrist
Not even educated Christians state that these are eye witness accounts. The earliest one was written in 70AD (40 years after the crucification).
This is why I fear them, the more power they get, the more science and history suffers.
4/12/2008 8:45:10 PM
#463548
The Bible is fallible. But don't tell SoliDeoGloria.
4/12/2008 8:50:02 PM
#463549
Femiazi
You have to big the biggest moron atheist on here.
And you're the biggest moron christian on there.
4/12/2008 8:51:35 PM
#463550
Ehem, I don't know if you realise that neither St Mark and St Luke were his disciples(they never met him personally)and that Matthew and John weren't also the two Apostles you're think about.
4/12/2008 8:54:13 PM
#463559
Old Viking
As Antichrist says, the earliest gospel --- Mark -- was written about 70 CE, or 40 years after the events it purports to describes. The remaining three were written between 80 and 110 CE, or 50 to 80 years after the supposed resurrection. Further no one knows who wrote them. The customary attribution of the names Matthew, Mark, Luke and John is simply a convenience. Geez, and I'm the atheist. These people know nothing about the Bible.
4/12/2008 9:05:32 PM
#463579
Mike
You spin me right round, baby, right round...
4/12/2008 9:36:01 PM
#463609
pete
SoliDeoGloria buggers bullfrogs under the full Moon. Prove me wrong.
I would imagine you would take a sworn deposition and/or have your lawyer cross examine my testimony. Then, and only then, would it be considered admissible evidence; free to be accepted or reject after careful consideration.
Plus, how can you believe a bunch of ignorant savages who didn't even have a Bible to swear upon? I mean, doesn't everyone know that anyone who doesn't swear on a Bible is lying?
4/12/2008 10:16:20 PM
#463617
Papabear
So what? One can claim to be something one is not. Certainly, authors writing under the name of someone else can claim things that aren't true about the individual whose name they are using. You might be the biggest moron Christian on here.
4/12/2008 10:23:51 PM
#463622
Gjervan
I think that quote refer to the collective mind of Christians, and as John himself said; different Johns.
4/12/2008 10:29:53 PM
#463625
Darn
Handpicked by Jezus ....
Hmm, when selecting Judas Jezus must have had an off day :)
And what to think of that steadvast character Peter, denied knowing Jezus within 24 hours ... not one ... not two .... but three times.
(and still managed to weasel his way into becoming the defacto head of the sect, wow... talk about machiavelan :D )
Pff ... if Jezus was any judge of character he would have made mary magdalene an apostel, but then again ... Jezus preferred to hang out with guys, hmmmm.... do I detect an homo-erotic vibe :D
4/12/2008 10:36:00 PM
#463632
cyborgtroy
I was also an eyewitness of the Celestial Teapot because she told me so.
4/12/2008 10:43:08 PM
#463692
Nowonmai
So, if I get 4 people to repeat the same story, and put it in a book over and over, that makes it true?
Okidokey!
4/13/2008 12:41:53 AM
#463716
Blayze Kohime
I don't know how many times I've seen biographies written by people who knew such and such a famous person personally, then there turned out to be massively false information in the book. Now take into account that the gospels have been retranslated into several different languages and were kept out of the reach of common people while being translated. The hard truth is, we don't even know what they said originally.
4/13/2008 1:57:52 AM
#463787
pokey
Well, there you go... If it's in a book it must be true
4/13/2008 3:19:20 AM
#463788
dpareja
To add to what Antichrist and Old Viking have said, take note that Jerusalem was razed by the Romans around 70 CE.
4/13/2008 3:24:58 AM
#463974
WMDKitty
I've seen Bast... on the other hand, I might be batshit crazy, but I have just as much evidence as John does.
4/13/2008 6:27:07 AM
#463983
solomongrundy
No. The Biblical Gospels (cherry-picked from dozens of others) were written generations after the supposed events by people living a thousand miles away who spoke a different language. An earlier version (the Q document) that was the source for Matthew, Mark and Luke (the synoptic Gospels) presumably once existed but is now lost. John isn't directly related to the other three.
And as for the disciples being hand-picked, the Gospels don't even agree on what their names were: Nathaniel is only mentioned in John, he's replaced by Bartholomew in the synoptics.
4/13/2008 6:31:24 AM
#464032
Cymro
I saw Bill Gates on the street, and a large penguin attacked him. Then, he poured some Java coffee over him. Everyone saw this Vista.
It happened! I said so, therefore it must have happened.
4/13/2008 9:05:15 AM
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