Quote# 119242

[Without legal abortion, illegal abortion would come back with all the horrors that brought.]

Can you give me some statistics on illegal abortions? I understand the whole "coathanger thing" was a myth.

Look at the countries where abortion is illegal. how many illegal abortions are there?

Also, if there were some risk to the mom's life in kiling her baby (whether through infection or whatever) it might make her wise up, and think ( in a selfish way of course) "I don't wanna die/get injured.. Id better bear and love this baby as my lord asks me to!"

Also, with all these women getting abortions.... Have they never heard of adoption??

Another thing.... whenever someone argues for protecting the unborn someone always brings up the example of "well what about some teenager who is raped?"

I think it should be allowed in that instance and think its a hideous circumstance. But let's be realistic. Far and away most of the time women seeking abortions aren't doing it because of that. Why don't liberals admit, that very often, perhaps even most of the time it is women who conceived after they forgot to take the pill, after the condom broke, or for some other reason, that they were unable to escape the consequences of their "screw everyone but me" hard partying life style?

Half the single mothers are such because of a simple lack of self control. Anyway, should we really encourage such a "consequence free" lifestyle? Instead of our politicians caving into this spirit, they should have the courage to say "You brought this burden on yourself. You bear it."

Janice_Spokes, AtheistForums.org 22 Comments [5/26/2016 3:10:33 AM]
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Submitted By: Stimbo

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Titania

No, the coathanger backyard abortions were a fact, and don't forget the knitting needles. BTW did the single fathers also have a simple lack of self control?

5/26/2016 3:25:59 AM

Dyz

Mind your own womb and it's products.

5/26/2016 3:52:20 AM

Tempus

The culture of life begins at conception and ends at birth.

But it never really gave a damn about the babies anyway. It was always about controlling women by controlling their reproductive choices, and punishing "sluts." The OP as much as admits it. That's it. Push a fetus-fetishist just right, and it'll come out--the loathing, the comparisons of sexually-active women with whores and wild animals, the venom, and almost none of it is directed at the male half of the equation.

5/26/2016 3:57:58 AM

Indicible

"Id better bear and love this baby as my lord asks me to!"

Oh, great, another divine slavery fetishist.

"they were unable to escape the consequences of their "screw everyone but me" hard partying life style? "

Right, forgetting the fact that few rapes occur during parties. The most rape-prone environment is family itself. Shall we get rid of that?

5/26/2016 4:13:55 AM

Mister Spak

"I understand the whole "coathanger thing" was a myth. "

I understand the whole" coathanger thing is a myth" is a myth. Try again.


5/26/2016 5:06:26 AM

Malingspann

Janice_Spokes: "Whenever someone argues for protecting the unborn someone always brings up the example of "well, what about some teenager who is raped?" I think it should be allowed in that instance and think its a hideous circumstance. But let's be realistic. Far and away most of the time women seeking abortions aren't doing it because of that. Why don't liberals admit, that very often, perhaps even most of the time it is women who conceived after CONSENSUAL sex! If she's not married, it shouldn't be allowed in that instance because that's whoredom; if she IS married, it shouldn't be allowed in that instance because married couples are SUPPOSED to have children! That's what marriage is FOR!!"

5/26/2016 5:20:47 AM

Doubting Thomas

Look at the countries where abortion is illegal. how many illegal abortions are there?

All of them. You know very well that since illegal abortions are illegal, the number of them goes unreported. But don't assume that since they're illegal they don't happen.

Also, if there were some risk to the mom's life in kiling her baby (whether through infection or whatever) it might make her wise up, and think ( in a selfish way of course) "I don't wanna die/get injured.. Id better bear and love this baby as my lord asks me to!"

If a woman is desperate enough to risk death in order to not have another child, then she's not going to stop and worry about what God wants.

Why don't liberals admit, that very often, perhaps even most of the time it is women who conceived after they forgot to take the pill, after the condom broke, or for some other reason, that they were unable to escape the consequences of their "screw everyone but me" hard partying life style?

Why don't conservatives admit, that very often, married women get abortions too?

The thing that annoys me about conservatives is that they always make these judgments about people. If you're poor, you must be a lazy bum looking for a handout. If you're gay, you must be a total pervert. If you're a woman wanting an abortion, it must be because you're a filthy slut who can't keep her legs together.

5/26/2016 5:46:36 AM

creativerealms

Also, with all these women getting abortions.... Have they never heard of adoption??

What about all those kids in the system already? The ones that need a good home but will probably end up raised in crowded state homes with no parents until they turn eighteen then sent off on their own. Kids too old to be adopted or the wrong color? You never seem to care about them.

Now that is NOT an argument for abortion more me just being pissed that these kids (I was one of them) are ignored and only unborn potential children are important to these people.

5/26/2016 5:54:20 AM

Mihangel apYrs

if you concede that there are times when it is allowable, then the argument is about conditions not about the principle

5/26/2016 5:54:47 AM

creativerealms

As for the "Screw everyone but me." What about those women who hate abortion until they get an unwanted pregnancy, get an abortion and then return to preventing others from having one. That does happen. Now that is "Screw everyone but me."

5/26/2016 5:56:55 AM

Darkevilme

"Have they never heard of adoption?? "

Aren't orphanages in the western world nearly collapsing under the weight of children they're taking care of already?

"that they were unable to escape the consequences of their"

I reject your demand that they accept these consequences. Parenthood must be a conscious decision , that's a human right and more than that it's just a good fucking idea to have them ready and willing for an 18 year endeavour beforehand. Or do you think forcing them into it will make them do BETTER?

but yes. I reject your demand we accept these natural consequences of having sex. The same way I reject the natural consequence of going out at night meaning i'd be eaten by wolves, or the consequence of being over 30 that my own teeth would probably kill me, or the natural consequence that any injury I suffered would get infected and kill me.

We can build a better world. we've built a better world. I don't want to live in yours.

5/26/2016 6:00:24 AM

pyro

> I don't wanna die/get injured..

Duh.

> Id better bear

Maybe. Let's ignore the fact that "death by childbirth" is more common than "death by cancer." Or maybe the back-alley abortion procedure in question is just that dangerous.

> and love

Or hate. Hating the child after they're born is just as likely to result in a death-by-coathanger-abortion as loving them.

Frankly, I think that's the more convincing argument anyway. Coathanger abortion could conceivably be eliminated through very consistent enforcement of the law. The result would be a rise in unwanted children.

> this baby as my lord asks me to!

Hahaha no.

5/26/2016 6:27:07 AM

Musicalbookworm

Rates of abortion remain the same whether or not it is legal. I don't believe in your God, so his desire does not enter into my thought process at all.

Here's the thing. I don't ever want to be pregnant. My birth control failing would not change that. I already have a plan, should abortion become impossible to access. I would start with high doses of vitamin C WITHOUT rose hips the day my period was late. I would hope I could buy RU-486 from Women on Waves, but if I can't I have a whole arsenal of folk abortaficients to try. My last resort would be pennyroyal.

I am a sexual being. I have the same right to my sexuality as any man. You misogynist cave dwellers can all go die in a fire.

5/26/2016 6:28:24 AM

Dr. Razark

"they should have the courage to say 'You brought this burden on yourself. You bear it.'"

Yeah, nothing's going to guarantee that child a quality life quite like forcing it on some woman who can't or doesn't desire to raise it.
(And just how many of those poor unfortunates have you adopted?)

5/26/2016 8:06:19 AM

PETF(People eating tasty fundies)

Then move then!

5/26/2016 9:47:34 AM

Alencon

The Guttmacher Institute has all the statistics you can ever need. Please notice that the abortion rate and the total number of abortions has gone down in Europe and North America where it tends to be legal and up just about everywhere else.

https://www.guttmacher.org/fact-sheet/facts-induced-abortion-worldwide?gclid=CIbYr62h-MwCFVJahgodFZMMNA

5/26/2016 10:30:21 AM

Phil O'Macedon

Victorian society in Great Britain had a stomach turning ability to tolerate grotesque levels of abject poverty without really bothering to do anything about it. That was because it was believed by most that poverty was the result of sin and therefore deserved. Does anybody wanna bet some serious money that this mindset has been eradicated in the xtian culture? And wait a freakin' second. I just heard a xtian radio show say that we all richly deserve hell for our sins. The entire premise of xtianity is declared to be consequence avoidance (redemption), and even if you're a mass murderer, you just have to say the shouldnadonit prayer, and your okay. That's not justice, justice is suspended, if you "belong to the club". If you're a good person who isn't in the club, burn. Look it up.

5/26/2016 12:40:41 PM

Quasirodent

Another anti-choicer equating a child with a 'burden' and a 'consequence'.
I don't know about most people, but I think if I were a child who was born unwanted to someone unable to properly care for me, who viewed me as a burden and a punishment, I'd wish I'd been aborted.

5/26/2016 1:31:43 PM

freako104

Quite a few happen in those

5/26/2016 2:19:28 PM

checkmate

I understand the whole "coathanger thing" was a myth.

Right. But Matthew 27:52-53, which tells us about zombies walking around in Jerusalem, is a fact. Ok. If you say so.

And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

5/26/2016 2:30:32 PM

Deep Search

... The anti-choice crowd proves that they only care about punishing women for having sex. Women should be punished via pregnancy, children should be a burden... Because that's moral, ethical, and healthy and all.

Gotta love how they believe women shouldn't act in their own best interests, like family planning is so awful and selfish. It's not like women choose abortion based purely on what they want/need, anyway. But the "pro-lifers" don't care, they simply like to judge.

5/28/2016 2:55:05 AM

creativerealms

It's not easy to find the stats on illegal operations by the very fact that they are illegal.

4/15/2018 5:00:52 PM

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